Fly fishing or not fly fishing?

[scudrunner]

Here is a nice little poll to engage some interaction and see where folks are on this very fundamental issue:

Do you consider fishing with beads to be fly fishing or not? Why or why not? What is your definition of fly fishing? And so on...

While a question like this can certainly raise the stress level... let's keep it civil and entertaining and educating.

Enjoy

[Globugger]

Depends on how you use it.. If you using it for things other than drifting a bead with a float up top then it's not fishing... If that makes sense

[RollinontheRvr]

That's an interesting question....I know alot of people including myself that drift fish with Globugs but if I am not mistaken they started out as a flyfishing technique correct? So then, if, you are drift fishing a bead as you would a Globug then I would think it would still be drift fishing. If you are swinging it it on a fly rod then it would be flyfishing....yeah, no, maybe?????? :)

[scudrunner]

I agree that it is fly fishing, but where the rub comes in is that a glo-bug is tied from hair,yarn,fur, or feathers and a bead is simply pegged on the line.

[Chinook SSSF]

The preffered technique for bead fishing is very much the same as indicator nympthing. I would have to say that a bead fished on a fly rod properly is called fly fishing. I know that is only an opinion that might upset some but staying honest, I do alot of odd ball stuff like chucking drift rigs on a fly rod or split shot and I honestly refuse to call that 'fly fishing' but it is still effective.

I also started out using glow bugs on a fly rod but with no indicator and I would often use split shot....in contrast this method was also NOT considered fly fishing per Oregon DFW. regulations because split shot could not be attached in fly only water, the fly must be weighted or the use of a sinking line must be employed.

That is the definition of fly fishing according to ODFW

The whole fly fishing or not thing is really down to opinion these days with so many crossover techniques being used around the world. Even people I fish with call some of these blacksheep methods fly fishing each and every day. I honestly believe that bead fishing may be closer to actuall fly fishing than anything else I have mentioned above that is currently in dispute throughout the fly fishing world.

Staying on track here IM going to vote 'fly fishing' if fished properly.....

[scudrunner]

I agree. The "traditional" view of fly fishing is crafting something from common materials to match a natural food source and lure the fish to strike (I just made that up... but I think it fits the bill).

When one considers beading, I believe it is simply matching the hatch. We are representing a natural food source, that being salmon eggs (or others). The rub seems to come in when we secure this to the line instead of the hook. Nevertheless, if you have even been to a sportsman's show or fishing show and seen Mr. Norlander working his vise, he applies a hot glue to a streamer hook and creates a "bead" attached to the hook.

I have used beads and heated the hook so that it would melt through the eye of the bead. This seems to work well, however not nearly as good as the glue gun eggs. I don't think this fishes as well either.

Having the bead pegged no more than 2" above the bare hook seems to be the most effective, efficient and ethical.

There is no doubt that certain members of society have drug the ethical beaders through the mud by pegging the bead a great distance (anything greater than 2" in my mind) from the hook, thereby "lining" the fish rather than evoking a strike. That is unethical in my book and not fly fishing. This often results in foul hooking, hooks through eyes or gills, and permanent scarring.

So, in my feeble mind, I believe that properly attached beads, cast with a fly rod/reel/line, using traditional fly fishing techniques, is fly fishing (of course there are some who do not consider nymphing to be fly fishing either).

[Chinook SSSF]

True and another point we could add is that part of the ******** and eye balling comes from to large of a hook. Also why the purists argue that beading is not fly fishing.

As with tying or using any fly correctly the hook must be properly proportioned in relation to the fly, and in this case for a bead, the hook must be VERY small....Size 6 and 8 seems to be close to correct for most applications...This also helps when you foul a salmon because you can bend the hook right out on the lighter line and not have to build a new rig.

[mikebraun]

Back to the original question, I don't consider it purist fly fishing. And with that said I'm glad I'm not a purist. A globug is a fly but a piece of yarn on a snelled hook isn't. A BB shot on your line is flyfishing but a size 4 shot means driftfishing whatever kind of rod you use. So even though I use a flyrod 80% of the time, I only consider it flyfishing when I have an actual fly on. The flyrod is just funner to use and more effective on medium and small water.

[scudrunner]

Mike,

Thanks for your post... I think I was able to follow...

Do you ever cast (Heaven forbid) bait:eek: with your fly rod?

[mikebraun]

Mike,

Thanks for your post... I think I was able to follow...

Do you ever cast (Heaven forbid) bait:eek: with your fly rod?

That was all I did when I was up there last spring on the lower peninsula fishing kings. Sometimes I will even clip on a little red/white trout bobber with a big glob of eggs, boy do I get some looks :confused:. They usually change their look when I'm catching fish though.
It all depends on where I'm at and whats the best or funnest way to catch fish. I may have given you the wrong impression of me, but I like to people guessing :cool:.

[Chinook SSSF]

Back to the original question, I don't consider it purist fly fishing. And with that said I'm glad I'm not a purist. A globug is a fly but a piece of yarn on a snelled hook isn't. A BB shot on your line is flyfishing but a size 4 shot means driftfishing whatever kind of rod you use. So even though I use a flyrod 80% of the time, I only consider it flyfishing when I have an actual fly on. The flyrod is just funner to use and more effective on medium and small water.

There is still the regulation that states split shot can not be used in fly only water. This includes BB shot....

Ironically this would also exclude indicator nymphing as a valid form of fly fishing. Unless you had a very heavy fly?

[scudrunner]

OK... Here is a story....

I flew across Cook Inlet with a couple of friends for some small stream king salmon fishing. I started to load my gear into the small craft and handed the pilot my 8 wt Lami and he looked at me and asked, "What are you going to do with that!?".

"I'm going to catch me a king salmon!" was my reply. With a sub audible chuckle, my friends shrugged and loaded the rod and gear.

We landed and then hiked a short distance to the stream and the game was on. I made a few casts with some streamers and managed to hook up with a couple dollies and one small jack king salmon.

A bit later, one of my friends came walking down stream to where I was. He had a big smile and was carrying a 25# chromer. So, I decided to make my way upstream to find the fish.

I found a very small but deep hole and figured that I would try to float some eggs through (that's right... on the fly rod). But, in order to do this, I had to walk the balance beam routine out on this particular log, maybe about 20'.

I casted the baited rig to the top of the hole and before it reached half way, WHAMMO!!! Fish on. As I yarded the stick back to set the hook, my feet gave way on the slimy log resulting in SPLASHO!!!

I managed to keep the rod out of the water and bent, caring less about being in over my waders at this point... The fish and I battled for about 15 minutes as I made my way back to solid ground. I managed to land this beaut... 35# chrome!

As I walked back downstream to my friends, their eyes were agape in amazement! I didn't say a word.

Wouldn't you know it, they were both back over the very next day with their fly rods....

[RollinontheRvr]

To Scudrunner, my question to you is this.....is someone up there seeing you using a bead set up and giving you grief about it...giving you some kind of "Holier than Thou" attitude or something? If so, then maybe they ought to mind there own damn business, as long as you are legal which I would be willing to say that is the case based on what you have said so far. Some people have a tendency to mind others business without regard to a persons feelings, beliefs or preferences. Watching Matthews videos, he has used a fly rod like a drift rod at times, hell, my ex father-in-law used to use a fly rod with a spinning reel when people started side drifting down here in the Portland area where I am from. Man, can you imagine the looks and comments he got????:eek: I don't look at things as rigid as some I guess, "Gearhead", "Bug Chucker", whatever your method of choice, go out to have fun not chastise others for the way they like to fish. Okay, I'll jump down off my soap box now....:cool:

[scudrunner]

Hey Rollin,

No worries here, simply a hot button topic starter... Of course bead fishing got its start right here on the Kenai River and is extremely effective in targeting resident species in anadramous streams.

Nevertheless, since the popularity of beading has reached mainstream fly fishing culture, many purists have become naysayers.

So, this was simply a way to generate some honest, entertaining and engaging debate. Thanks for your concern, nevertheless.

[RollinontheRvr]

I get kinda irritated with people that try force their opinion on others. Your poll sure got me going didn't it? :D Your poll goes along the lines of jigging. Some guys down here freak out when it is mentioned but if done right it is a productive method. I have seen some that jerk the rod up quick instead of just raising it. My understanding is that the fish hits the jig on the downward flutter not as the rod is lifted up, so why jerk it up? That to me is where ******** comes into to play. In any case someone is going to bitch no matter what method we choose to fish huh? :eek:

[mikebraun]

into to In any case someone is going to bitch no matter what method we choose to fish huh? :eek:

If it works and your doing it right then let em bitch, and you can keep catchin while they're bitchin.